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Today in Health IT

CHIME Fall Forum 21 – Paddy Padmanabhan with Damo Consulting

Questions answered in this episode

  1. How are health systems moving beyond pandemic crisis mode into intentional digital transformation?
  2. What's the real barrier to telehealth adoption—technology integration or user engagement?
  3. Should health systems worry more about CVS and Walmart than Amazon and Google?
  4. Why do tech giants' healthcare initiatives lack clear leadership and unified strategy?
  5. Can big tech companies succeed in healthcare when it's only a part-time priority?

About this episode

Paddy Padmanabhan and I catch up and discuss progress in digital health. We don't always agree but Paddy makes me think about what I believe about how Digital Health will play out in healthcare. Hope you enjoy.

Transcript

Bill Russell 00:00:03 Today in health, it interviews from the chime Bill Russell 00:00:05 conference in San Diego. Bill Russell 00:00:07 My name is bill Russell. Bill Russell 00:00:08 I'm a former CIO for a 16 hospital system and creator of this week in health. Bill Russell 00:00:11 It a channel dedicated to keeping health it staff current and engaged. Bill Russell 00:00:16 Just a quick reminder. Bill Russell 00:00:17 I wouldn't be dropping interviews over the next couple of days and into Bill Russell 00:00:20 next week from the chime conference. Bill Russell 00:00:23 And then I'm going to have some more interviews from the next conference I Bill Russell 00:00:27 want to be going to, and then eventually I'll get back to Florida and to the studio Bill Russell 00:00:32 where we'll start looking at the news. Bill Russell 00:00:33 Once again. Bill Russell 00:00:34 Hope you enjoy this interview. Bill Russell 00:00:36 Another interview from the chime fall forum and we have Patty . Am Bill Russell 00:00:41 I getting your name right? Bill Russell 00:00:42 Absolutely. Paddy Padmanabhan 00:00:42 You're as close as it can. Paddy Padmanabhan 00:00:44 As close as you want to Bill Russell 00:00:46 be. Bill Russell 00:00:46 Uh, I use Domo consulting, but really you are a digital health leader. Bill Russell 00:00:51 You're you do a lot of conversations around digital health. Bill Russell 00:00:54 A lot of publications write a lot of articles around digital health. Bill Russell 00:00:56 So that's the topic I'd like to. Bill Russell 00:00:59 Sure if you're offering that. Bill Russell 00:01:00 So what's, so what's top of mind at this conference, you've had some conversations Bill Russell 00:01:04 you've been here for a day or so, so, Paddy Padmanabhan 00:01:06 well, the F the first thing on everybody's mind is Paddy Padmanabhan 00:01:09 relief and having the opportunity to come out and meet people. Paddy Padmanabhan 00:01:14 I can say I can speak for myself that, uh, it's been a long time since we got Paddy Padmanabhan 00:01:19 out and got to meet our colleagues. Paddy Padmanabhan 00:01:20 And in many way, chime is like an extended family to many of us, the chime community. Paddy Padmanabhan 00:01:26 So it's wonderful to be here. Paddy Padmanabhan 00:01:27 So I would say top of mind, Uh, sense of getting back together for people and Paddy Padmanabhan 00:01:33 meeting your colleagues in person after such a long time after what we've all Paddy Padmanabhan 00:01:38 been through for the last 18 months or so? Paddy Padmanabhan 00:01:41 Well, business wise, I think, uh, you know, it seems to me from the Paddy Padmanabhan 00:01:45 conversations that I'm having that over the last 18 months, things have Paddy Padmanabhan 00:01:49 moved forward significantly from a digital transformation standpoint. Paddy Padmanabhan 00:01:53 Obviously the, the, the, the earliest. Paddy Padmanabhan 00:01:57 Was the pandemic itself, but then there, the early response to the pandemic, Paddy Padmanabhan 00:02:02 which was more of a crisis response has given way to a more thoughtful Paddy Padmanabhan 00:02:07 transformation approach that builds on whatever foundations were laid Paddy Padmanabhan 00:02:11 prior to the pandemic and whatever investments were made subsequent to Paddy Padmanabhan 00:02:15 the kind of, so we are moving now into a new phase is what I feel. Paddy Padmanabhan 00:02:19 And the general sense I get is there's a lot to be done and it's just. Paddy Padmanabhan 00:02:25 It's just the opportunity is huge. Bill Russell 00:02:27 So early on it was reactive, but we saw a lot of really cool things. Bill Russell 00:02:29 We saw. Bill Russell 00:02:30 We saw chatbots deployed for, uh, for diagnosis of COVID. Bill Russell 00:02:36 We saw, um, uh, new, new kinds of, uh, tele-health, uh, modalities sort of, Bill Russell 00:02:42 sort of pop up from a safety standpoint. Bill Russell 00:02:44 We went to create that, that safe distance and whatnot. Bill Russell 00:02:48 Um, but a lot of this stuff was done. Bill Russell 00:02:50 Okay, we need this tomorrow. Bill Russell 00:02:52 Now we'd been working on it for some years, but still we were Bill Russell 00:02:54 able to stand some things up. Bill Russell 00:02:56 I mean, how much are we having to go back and rethink some of the things Bill Russell 00:03:01 we did in the pandemic and really laid down a, a digital, let's say a Bill Russell 00:03:05 foundation for digital, or what's the foundation for digital already there Paddy Padmanabhan 00:03:10 from a technology standpoint? Paddy Padmanabhan 00:03:12 I think, uh, there's a lot that has been accomplished in terms of Paddy Padmanabhan 00:03:16 putting in the new technologies. Paddy Padmanabhan 00:03:18 And I'd say this. Paddy Padmanabhan 00:03:20 If I was to talk about the unfinished business or the work in progress, Paddy Padmanabhan 00:03:23 they would talk about two things. Paddy Padmanabhan 00:03:25 One is making all these technology pieces work together Paddy Padmanabhan 00:03:28 well, making it all seamless. Paddy Padmanabhan 00:03:31 And the other part of it is helping people adopt and use the technologies. Paddy Padmanabhan 00:03:36 I think one of the big concerns on the minds of my clients and Paddy Padmanabhan 00:03:40 others that I talked to is how do you get people to use it? Paddy Padmanabhan 00:03:43 And actually the more recent data seems to suggest that. Paddy Padmanabhan 00:03:46 Bit of a pullback and the use of the tele-health and the virtual care Paddy Padmanabhan 00:03:51 modalities or whatever reason, but, uh, Bill Russell 00:03:54 yeah. Bill Russell 00:03:55 So are we worried about, so you and I go back and forth on social Bill Russell 00:03:58 media and a lot of times it's, it's apple, Amazon, you know, the big Bill Russell 00:04:02 players, what are they going to do? Bill Russell 00:04:04 Are our health system still keeping an eye out for the Walmarts? Bill Russell 00:04:08 The CVS is in the others, Paddy Padmanabhan 00:04:11 the competitive landscape for health city. Paddy Padmanabhan 00:04:15 Is the Walmarts of the Syria assists, the big corporations that are Paddy Padmanabhan 00:04:20 traditionally not traditionally, not healthcare organizations. Paddy Padmanabhan 00:04:24 And then you've got the big tech firms. Paddy Padmanabhan 00:04:25 You mentioned Amazon and Google apple, and then you've got the digital Paddy Padmanabhan 00:04:30 first, you know, healthcare providers. Paddy Padmanabhan 00:04:33 They go the one medicals on the Oak street, health of the world. Paddy Padmanabhan 00:04:36 What our health system. Paddy Padmanabhan 00:04:37 Why do I think they're more worried about the CVS and the Walmarts than Paddy Padmanabhan 00:04:40 they are, frankly, about Microsoft or. Paddy Padmanabhan 00:04:44 Amazon, maybe because Amazon's crossed the Rubicon from being a Paddy Padmanabhan 00:04:47 technology provider into more of a healthcare service provider. Paddy Padmanabhan 00:04:50 But as you know, I've written about this, you know, the outcome is far from Paddy Padmanabhan 00:04:54 foretold in terms of their success. Paddy Padmanabhan 00:04:56 At this point, they Bill Russell 00:04:58 do have a long view though. Bill Russell 00:04:59 I mean, and the thing is Amazon doesn't have to be successful in all the things. Bill Russell 00:05:03 I mean, they're going to be, it'll be interesting to see in the Bill Russell 00:05:07 let's just call it the PBM space. Bill Russell 00:05:08 Let's call it the, uh, the, the medication. Bill Russell 00:05:12 I mean, th their acquisition seems like, seems like a pretty solid Bill Russell 00:05:15 foundation from which to build on. Bill Russell 00:05:17 It builds on their, their current capabilities and they can do those things. Bill Russell 00:05:22 But is that really a tech player or is that more of a logistics play Paddy Padmanabhan 00:05:26 for that? Paddy Padmanabhan 00:05:29 You know, the Amazon bets are kind of all over the place. Paddy Padmanabhan 00:05:32 They are all over the place. Paddy Padmanabhan 00:05:33 I don't see a Bill Russell 00:05:35 where you at the health conference. Bill Russell 00:05:36 I was not, but if you go through their booth, Hey, would you Bill Russell 00:05:40 like to talk to Amazon care? Bill Russell 00:05:41 Would you like to talk to AWS? Bill Russell 00:05:42 Would you like what data would they were? Bill Russell 00:05:45 Well, Paddy Padmanabhan 00:05:46 here's the thing that I'd asked you, this question, is there one Paddy Padmanabhan 00:05:49 individual in Amazon that you can think of who is kind of like the healthcare Bill Russell 00:05:54 person? Bill Russell 00:05:55 Yeah. Bill Russell 00:05:55 Yeah. Bill Russell 00:05:55 There, there used to be, but he went to work for Phillips. Bill Russell 00:05:57 So I don't know. Bill Russell 00:05:58 Okay. Paddy Padmanabhan 00:05:59 I don't know that there is such an annuity, but I do Paddy Padmanabhan 00:06:01 know that there are several individuals who are all among themselves driving. Paddy Padmanabhan 00:06:07 Initiatives. Paddy Padmanabhan 00:06:08 Yeah. Paddy Padmanabhan 00:06:08 Amazon carries with somebody, the PillPack tenders with somebody else. Paddy Padmanabhan 00:06:11 God knows what else, you know, in Amazon. Bill Russell 00:06:14 Well, and that's what we're seeing. Bill Russell 00:06:16 Yeah. Bill Russell 00:06:16 Apple is Apple's the most recent one with the article and whatnot. Bill Russell 00:06:20 And, uh, there doesn't seem to be, first of all, the CEO Bill Russell 00:06:25 is the CEO of apple, correct? Bill Russell 00:06:27 They're not the CPE CEO of apple health. Bill Russell 00:06:29 Correct. Bill Russell 00:06:29 So how much of his time is actually spent thinking about the, I've Paddy Padmanabhan 00:06:33 asked this exact same question in my writings, you know what. Paddy Padmanabhan 00:06:37 Healthcare is at best a part-time job for the CEO of any of these large Paddy Padmanabhan 00:06:43 corporations and mind you, the new look at the world from their standpoint, their Paddy Padmanabhan 00:06:49 opportunity in healthcare may be huge, but at the present moment, they may have Paddy Padmanabhan 00:06:55 much bigger things going on that are, you know, dominating their attention. Paddy Padmanabhan 00:07:00 But don't Bill Russell 00:07:00 the, the promise of those companies. Bill Russell 00:07:04 Is with AWS. Bill Russell 00:07:05 You have, you have a great, great access to that technology, the Bill Russell 00:07:09 data technology, the AI with Google, you have access to that. Bill Russell 00:07:13 I mean, clearly they've, they're phenomenal at the data side and whatnot. Bill Russell 00:07:16 Microsoft is phenomenal at the data side, Microsoft, probably a different story Bill Russell 00:07:20 because they're, they're just an enabler. Bill Russell 00:07:23 Yeah. Bill Russell 00:07:24 I don't think they have any healthcare aspirations per Paddy Padmanabhan 00:07:26 se. Paddy Padmanabhan 00:07:27 Well, their healthcare story is the cloud story. Paddy Padmanabhan 00:07:29 You know, the workplace collaboration story and Bill Russell 00:07:32 everybody who's here has a relationship. Paddy Padmanabhan 00:07:34 Everybody has a relationship with them. Paddy Padmanabhan 00:07:35 And then as they make acquisitions, like no-one's, I just came out of Paddy Padmanabhan 00:07:38 this session with nuance, you know? Paddy Padmanabhan 00:07:40 So who knows what that is? Paddy Padmanabhan 00:07:41 So they're in that session, that session was titled digital front doors nuance is, Paddy Padmanabhan 00:07:46 you know, in the digital front door space. Paddy Padmanabhan 00:07:47 So is Microsoft also in the digital front. Paddy Padmanabhan 00:07:49 That's right. Paddy Padmanabhan 00:07:50 So, uh, you could not, but then, you know, with all of these large Paddy Padmanabhan 00:07:54 companies, there's always multiple bets. Paddy Padmanabhan 00:07:56 You know, you talk about Amazon, Amazon has a half a dozen things. Paddy Padmanabhan 00:07:58 We've got Alex, or they've got Amazon care, they've got the cloud Paddy Padmanabhan 00:08:01 business, which is doing very well. Paddy Padmanabhan 00:08:02 They've got the PillPack business who knows what else is going to come up. Paddy Padmanabhan 00:08:06 And again, we've also seen a little bit of a pullback by these big tech firms. Paddy Padmanabhan 00:08:10 Recently, Google closed its healthcare business. Paddy Padmanabhan 00:08:13 Officially there is no health business, especially after David Paddy Padmanabhan 00:08:17 Feinberg left and went on to. Paddy Padmanabhan 00:08:19 And then now you've got apple, apple shut down their primary care Paddy Padmanabhan 00:08:22 business, which was anywhere meant to be a kind of pilot of some kind. Paddy Padmanabhan 00:08:25 Right. Paddy Padmanabhan 00:08:26 But Amazon's the one that's sticking it through. Paddy Padmanabhan 00:08:28 And then there are others who are, you know, who knows what Salesforce Bill Russell 00:08:32 is going to do for it. Bill Russell 00:08:33 So we have to be clear just carrying the salvo, got up there last week and said, Bill Russell 00:08:37 we're still, we're still in healthcare. Bill Russell 00:08:39 We're doing this, we're doing this or that. Bill Russell 00:08:40 So she rattled off the half dozen things that they are continuing to do. Bill Russell 00:08:45 And her thing is, look, we're we're in information. Bill Russell 00:08:49 And more people seek care from Google still today than anywhere else. Bill Russell 00:08:53 And so they're trying to utilize their position to really direct Bill Russell 00:08:59 people in the right, get the right information to them serve public health. Bill Russell 00:09:03 It used to be when we started the pandemic, we had to go to certain sites Bill Russell 00:09:06 to search this, some of these statistics. Bill Russell 00:09:09 And I find now I can just go and say, yep, this guy, San Diego county tell Bill Russell 00:09:13 me the COVID statistics said, Google. Bill Russell 00:09:17 Hold it all together. Bill Russell 00:09:17 That's what they do. Paddy Padmanabhan 00:09:18 Yeah. Paddy Padmanabhan 00:09:19 And again, like you said earlier on, well, it's a long game Paddy Padmanabhan 00:09:23 for, for these big tech firms. Paddy Padmanabhan 00:09:25 They have deep pockets. Paddy Padmanabhan 00:09:27 It doesn't mean though that they're going to stick with a Paddy Padmanabhan 00:09:29 losing proposition for too long. Paddy Padmanabhan 00:09:31 If something doesn't work, they'll probably kill it, take the learnings Paddy Padmanabhan 00:09:35 from it and put it into something else and then start the next iteration. Paddy Padmanabhan 00:09:39 And they have the, they have the, well, they have the money. Paddy Padmanabhan 00:09:43 And if they want to do something, they can stick around long enough to do it. Paddy Padmanabhan 00:09:47 I mean, just think of the amount of cash that apple is sitting by. Paddy Padmanabhan 00:09:49 It's just unbelievable. Bill Russell 00:09:50 All of them are sitting on top of the Fairmount. Bill Russell 00:09:52 So if people are engaged, Dame-o consulting, what, Bill Russell 00:09:55 what do you guys do for we? Paddy Padmanabhan 00:09:57 Uh, we help, we work mostly with CEOs, chief digital Paddy Padmanabhan 00:10:01 officers and C-suite executives who are responsible for the digital Paddy Padmanabhan 00:10:05 transformation of their organization. Paddy Padmanabhan 00:10:08 Very deeply focused on the health system space. Paddy Padmanabhan 00:10:10 So that's where most of our work is. Paddy Padmanabhan 00:10:12 So we'll help with digital strategy, helping develop digital transformation, Paddy Padmanabhan 00:10:15 roadmaps, prioritizing initiatives, building business cases for them Paddy Padmanabhan 00:10:19 helping with technology, partner selection, and also the ongoing Paddy Padmanabhan 00:10:23 governance of digital programs. Paddy Padmanabhan 00:10:25 So that's kind of what we do. Paddy Padmanabhan 00:10:26 We come at it from a technology standpoint, but in the context of Paddy Padmanabhan 00:10:29 digital transformation, which is very, very much tech enabled as we speak Bill Russell 00:10:34 the big and the lock is still. Paddy Padmanabhan 00:10:37 Uh, big unlock. Paddy Padmanabhan 00:10:38 Thank you for mentioning that the podcast, just a hindrance hit a hundred episodes. Paddy Padmanabhan 00:10:42 So kind of fantastic kicked about, I know how hard Bill Russell 00:10:45 that is by the way. Bill Russell 00:10:46 That's not Paddy Padmanabhan 00:10:46 as easy as what people think. Paddy Padmanabhan 00:10:48 Yeah, I, yeah. Paddy Padmanabhan 00:10:49 And I've been really, really fortunate to have some great guests on the show. Paddy Padmanabhan 00:10:52 So yeah, I mean, these are a really thoughtful conversations. Paddy Padmanabhan 00:10:57 I learned a lot from those conversations and I hope that Paddy Padmanabhan 00:11:00 the listeners learn something. Paddy Padmanabhan 00:11:02 You know, I was, I was sitting with, uh, some people at breakfast today. Paddy Padmanabhan 00:11:06 I didn't know them at all, but they knew who I was because Paddy Padmanabhan 00:11:08 I listened to my podcast. Paddy Padmanabhan 00:11:10 So I'm probably the Bill Russell 00:11:11 same thing. Bill Russell 00:11:11 Yeah. Bill Russell 00:11:12 Thank you both. Paddy Padmanabhan 00:11:14 First of all, I thank you for all the work that you do. Paddy Padmanabhan 00:11:16 I'm an avid follower of all of your work on social media and continue Paddy Padmanabhan 00:11:21 to keep those snarky comments. Paddy Padmanabhan 00:11:22 Comment. Paddy Padmanabhan 00:11:24 It's been Bill Russell 00:11:24 exciting. Bill Russell 00:11:25 I think it does help the industry. Bill Russell 00:11:26 When we go back and forth, people see, Hey, there's Bill Russell 00:11:28 potentially different challenges. Bill Russell 00:11:30 The Paddy Padmanabhan 00:11:30 group thing, challenge the group thing. Paddy Padmanabhan 00:11:33 I'm reading this book called the contrarian, watch the buck, Peter Thiel. Paddy Padmanabhan 00:11:36 So you can be the country. Paddy Padmanabhan 00:11:38 I didn't know. Bill Russell 00:11:39 Well, if only I had as much money as Peter's deal, I think Bill Russell 00:11:42 I could be contrary and on anything. Paddy Padmanabhan 00:11:44 We'll see. Paddy Padmanabhan 00:11:45 All right, thanks. Paddy Padmanabhan 00:11:47 Thank you. Bill Russell 00:11:48 Don't forget to check back as we have more of these interviews Bill Russell 00:11:50 coming to you, that's all for today. Bill Russell 00:11:52 If you know of someone that might benefit from our channel, Bill Russell 00:11:54 please forward them a note. Bill Russell 00:11:55 They can subscribe on our website this week, health.com or wherever you listen Bill Russell 00:11:59 to podcasts, apple, Google, overcast, Spotify, Stitcher, you get the picture. Bill Russell 00:12:03 We are everywhere. Bill Russell 00:12:05 We want to thank our channel sponsors who are investing in our mission to Bill Russell 00:12:08 develop the next generation of health. Bill Russell 00:12:10 VMware Hill-Rom Starbridge advisors, McAfee and Aruba networks. Bill Russell 00:12:15 Thanks for listening.

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